RE External RE Follow up from Presubmission meetingDerek,
I think our stormwater facilities would probably be the same size and footprint if we had paved storage or gravel storage since they’re both impervious surfaces, but like you said that
would be taken care by the civil engineer.
Thanks for clarifying, we are now taking a hard look at the gopher problem that can’t be officially determined until the gopher window next summer.
Thank you,
Kelson McClung
Mike McClung Construction Co.
MIKEMCC981KB
o: (360) 761-7695
f: (360) 761-7529
c: (253) 397-9049
From: Derek McCoy <DerekM@Yelmwa.gov>
Sent: Wednesday, November 18, 2020 4:41 PM
To: Kelson McClung <kelson@mcclungconstruction.com>; Steve McClung <steve@mcclungconstruction.com>
Cc: Tami Merriman <tamim@Yelmwa.gov>; Cody Colt <CodyC@Yelmwa.gov>; Grant Beck <grantb@Yelmwa.gov>
Subject: RE: [External]RE: Follow up from Presubmission meeting.
Kelson / Steve,
I apologize for the delay in response but my workload has been particularly busy of late. I want to start out this conversation by highlighting the Stormwater section of the Pre-Submission
Meeting notes that state;
Stormwater must be collected, treated, and infiltrated on the project site. The engineer preparing the civil plans will determine the required level of treatment and will prepare a storm
water plan for the City to review as part of the civil plan review process. The City has adopted the most recent version (2019) of the Washington State Department of Ecology Storm
Water Manual. (SWMMWW).
If you were to propose storage areas, the Stormwater Site Plan must reflect that runoff is being collected and diverted to treatment and infiltration facilities and comply with 2019
SWMMWW. The ICE and APM plans include a bioretention swale/cells for treatment and infiltration ponds and the compacted gravel areas are graded so runoff is directed towards them. From
reviewing the pictures you provided it does not appear to be the case with your existing yard. I have attached a couple of slides with some brief notes about them.
Stormwater facilities usually consist of aboveground swales and/or ponds because the construction cost is less but take up a lot of land. In cases where conservation of space is a concern
below ground facilities and pervious pavement systems are an attractive option. While it has not been used in the City of Yelm, I have personally been involved in a project in Olympia
that TrueGrid System was used. (https://www.truegridpaver.com/5-ways-to-reduce-parking-lot-design-costs-with-permeable-pavers/) This is merely a suggestion and not an indication that
it is required.
I look forward to reviewing what your engineer comes up with for a Site Plan Application and working with them further if and when your project moves into Civil Plan Review.
Derek M. McCoy, PE, Civil Review Engineer / Project Engineer
Office 360.458.8132 Cell 253.278.2937
www.yelmwa.gov <http://www.yelmwa.gov/>
From: Kelson McClung <kelson@mcclungconstruction.com <mailto:kelson@mcclungconstruction.com> >
Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2020 4:52 PM
To: Derek McCoy <DerekM@Yelmwa.gov <mailto:DerekM@Yelmwa.gov> >; Steve McClung <steve@mcclungconstruction.com <mailto:steve@mcclungconstruction.com> >
Cc: Tami Merriman <tamim@Yelmwa.gov <mailto:tamim@Yelmwa.gov> >; Cody Colt <CodyC@Yelmwa.gov <mailto:CodyC@Yelmwa.gov> >; Grant Beck <grantb@Yelmwa.gov <mailto:grantb@Yelmwa.gov> >
Subject: RE: [External]RE: Follow up from Presubmission meeting.
Derek,
I need further clarification. Per your email below, the City was under the impression that our Contractor Yard would function more like a parking lot, motor pool and vehicle loading
area. I agree with this interpretation for the front of the business for office/salary employees and possibly around the shop area. However, the back of the business will not function
like a parking lot. It will function like a Contractor’s Yard.
The impression that we got from the meeting is that the entire area of our property (if we choose to purchase it) would be required to be covered by a permanent wearing surface. There
were two options you gave us in the meeting that would be required for any area that heavy equipment, trucks or materials would travel (regardless of frequency) or be stored. This was
either asphalt pavement or a clean crushed/geotextile/sand layer contained in baskets (I believe that’s how you described it). We wanted to grade and compact native subgrade and put
down crushed rock for our storage area. We were told this is not allowed and the plans you were going to send us would show us this second gravel/geotextile/sand option and what we
were allowed to do.
However, the plans you sent did not show what you described at the meeting, they instead showed CSBC (which we were told is not allowed), so I am further confused how our Contractor
Yard would not be allowed any storage area similar to NPM or ICE, and we are instead being classified as strictly 100% parking area. At the meeting, you said that if we used a loader
with forks or a forklift or an excavator to unload and store pipe, bricks, catch basins or other construction materials we would need to pave that area. However, it is also possible
for NPM and ICE to store “parts and equipment” that would be “offloaded by crane or placed by hand.” We were told this is not possible if the truck delivering the materials or equipment
unloading the truck had to drive to the unloading area. So, will they be installing a tower crane or something similar? Their storage yard covers an approx. area of 8 Acres. To unload
and store anything in this large of an area without driving on it seems nonsensical. So, I’m thinking we are either special and must be classified as a parking lot because we are a
Contractor, or we are not presenting our idea clearly.
In a final attempt to clarify our proposed plan, I’ve attached some photos of our equipment and materials currently in our yard. For further clarification, we are a public works general
contractor. In public works construction, 99% of all permanent materials are delivered directly to the job site at the time of installation. We are not a warehouse or distribution center.
We do not have regular trucking traffic other than our lowboy who moves equipment from our yard to job sites, but that equipment lives on that job site for months at a time. Often times,
it goes directly from one job to the next. We also have a side dump, but it leaves in the morning and returns at the end of the day or is parked at the driver’s house. It is not driving
in and out of the property throughout the entire day it goes out and works for other clients. Any materials stored are left over from changes in quantity on the project or when we store
pipe for reuse as temporary bypass pipe on in-stream excavation projects. The rest of the regular traffic of our salary office staff or mechanic or any foremen or superintendents will
have ample parking for their pickups in our designated parking area that is determined by the parking lot calculation provided at the meeting for our office and shop square footage
or total number of employees at any given time.
I agree that the front of the house will function as a parking lot for the office/salary people. That is why we have a parking lot shown on our drawing. However, we also should be allowed
some storage area for the back end of our Contractor’s yard, and all I’m hearing is that we are not allowed any storage area and all of it must be paved.
Please look again at our attached proposed schematic drawing. If we have satisfied the parking area requirement for the office (in red) and have paved asphalt/concrete around the shop
(green) are we allowed any CSBC storage area (orange)? Or, like you’ve previously suggested, must we pave the entire property and everything we are calling a Contractor’s Yard is being
considered a parking lot/motor pool by the City? Or, if we can only use the CSBC area if we access it by foot or crane, what size and type of crane is allowed since we are not allowed
to drive on the CSBC?
As you said below, “The bottom line is all areas that are used for parking/storage of motorized vehicles, maintenance of vehicles, loading and unloading of vehicles and/or trailers,
and subject to regular traffic are required to have a permanent wearing surface.” For our proposed CSBC storage area, this is not something that will be supplied and loaded out on a
regular basis. It is used for long term storage and in our opinion does not function like a parking lot or motor pool.
It seems to me that the paving area calculation provided at the meeting should tell us how much parking area is required. Will we be allowed any CSBC storage area? Or as you’ve previously
suggested, will we be required to pave the entire area? Also, please see the attached heavy equipment photos. For anywhere those pieces of heavy equipment (not licensed motor vehicles)
travel and park on our property, will a permanent wearing surface be required?
Please clarify.
Thank you,
Kelson McClung
Mike McClung Construction Co.
MIKEMCC981KB
o: (360) 761-7695
f: (360) 761-7529
c: (253) 397-9049
From: Derek McCoy <DerekM@Yelmwa.gov <mailto:DerekM@Yelmwa.gov> >
Sent: Monday, November 9, 2020 3:24 PM
To: Kelson McClung <kelson@mcclungconstruction.com <mailto:kelson@mcclungconstruction.com> >; Steve McClung <steve@mcclungconstruction.com <mailto:steve@mcclungconstruction.com> >
Cc: Tami Merriman <tamim@Yelmwa.gov <mailto:tamim@Yelmwa.gov> >; Cody Colt <CodyC@Yelmwa.gov <mailto:CodyC@Yelmwa.gov> >; Grant Beck <grantb@Yelmwa.gov <mailto:grantb@Yelmwa.gov> >
Subject: RE: [External]RE: Follow up from Presubmission meeting.
Steve and Kelson,
I was only involved in the NPM Recycling Yard review as this was one of the first that came across my desk and I believe that where some confusion is coming in is what exactly is meant
by a storage yard. The storage yards depicted in the NPM and ICE plans were proposed for placement of parts and equipment and would not be used for parking of any motor vehicle, and
subject to minor traffic as the parts and equipment would be offloaded by crane or placed by hand. These are areas were submitted under the assumption that they were not subject to
activities that you would find in parking lots, motor pools, and vehicle loading areas. During the presubmission meeting the impression that the City had was you were proposing an area
that was more along the line of the later. I think the bottom line is all areas that are used for parking/storage of motorized vehicles, maintenance of vehicles, loading and unloading
of vehicles and/or trailers, and subject to regular traffic then it will be required to have a permanent all weather surface. This is discussed in further detail in excerpts from Yelm
Engineering Standard Specifications and Details (Development Guidelines) Chapter 2 Transportation below;
2.60.080 Parking Lots
Standards for parking lot construction.
A. Materials and Workmanship. Materials and workmanship for all parking lot construction regardless if a parking lot construction permit is required, must comply with City adopted standards
and specifications. Parking lot surfacing materials shall satisfy the requirement for a permanent all weather surface. Asphalt concrete pavement and cement concrete pavement satisfy
this requirement and are approved materials. Gravel surfaces are not acceptable or approved surface material types. Combination grass/paving systems are approved materials types, however,
their use requires submittal of an overall parking lot paving plan showing the limits of the grass/paving system sand a description of how the systems will be irrigated and maintained.
If the Public Works Director determines the grass/paving system is not appropriate for the specific application, alternate approved surfacing materials shall be utilized.
B. Other types of surfacing materials will be considered subject to the approval of the Public Works Director prior to construction.
Later in this same section under D Parking area construction shall include:
1. Surfacing. All parking areas shall be surfaced with asphalt, concrete or similar pavement so as to provide a permanent all weather surface that is durable and dust-free and shall
be so graded and drained as to properly dispose of all surface water. Gravel surfaces are not acceptable or approved surface material.
Once a Site Plan Application has been submitted the pavement requirements can be better determined as we will have a better understanding of what it is you are proposing. I hope that
helps clarify things.
Derek M. McCoy, PE, Civil Review Engineer / Project Engineer
Office 360.458.8132 Cell 253.278.2937
www.yelmwa.gov <http://www.yelmwa.gov/>
From: Tami Merriman <tamim@Yelmwa.gov <mailto:tamim@Yelmwa.gov> >
Sent: Monday, November 9, 2020 1:28 PM
To: Kelson McClung <kelson@mcclungconstruction.com <mailto:kelson@mcclungconstruction.com> >; Steve McClung <steve@mcclungconstruction.com <mailto:steve@mcclungconstruction.com> >
Cc: Derek McCoy <DerekM@Yelmwa.gov <mailto:DerekM@Yelmwa.gov> >
Subject: RE: [External]RE: Follow up from Presubmission meeting.
Steve and Kelson
I am deferring this question to our Civil Review Engineer. He is included in this email.
Tami Merriman, Associate Planner
360.458.8496
www.yelmwa.gov <http://www.yelmwa.gov/>
From: Kelson McClung [mailto:kelson@mcclungconstruction.com]
Sent: Monday, November 9, 2020 1:07 PM
To: Tami Merriman <tamim@Yelmwa.gov <mailto:tamim@Yelmwa.gov> >; Steve McClung <steve@mcclungconstruction.com <mailto:steve@mcclungconstruction.com> >
Subject: [External]RE: Follow up from Presubmission meeting.
Tami,
Per your attached NPR Recycling Civil Plans, on Sheet C3.1, in the center of the page there is clearly a note that says, “Gravel Yard Storage Area – Strip top 4” sod and fine grade.
Add 6” CSBC compacted to 95%.
Also, per your attached ICE Storage Yard Plans, on Sheet C2.1, on the left side of the plan, there is clearly a note that says, “Compacted Gravel Storage Yard” and per Detail 1/C3.4,
it shows 10” CSTC compacted to 95% on top of compacted native soil.
Based on our conversation last week regarding our proposed contractor storage yard, these two drawings are in conflict with what we were told was going to be required by the City. It
was our understanding that we would have to either A) pave all areas or B) install a sand/geotextile/clean crushed grid system under all storage areas, but no evidence of either of
those options are shown on the civil plans you sent over for similar applications.
We were specifically told that simply grading, compacting, and adding compacted crushed rock would not be acceptable for our equipment/materials storage area. However, that is exactly
what both of these drawings show.
Please clarify.
Thank you,
Kelson McClung
Mike McClung Construction Co.
MIKEMCC981KB
o: (360) 761-7695
f: (360) 761-7529
c: (253) 397-9049
From: Tami Merriman <tamim@Yelmwa.gov <mailto:tamim@Yelmwa.gov> >
Sent: Thursday, November 5, 2020 8:27 AM
To: Steve McClung <steve@mcclungconstruction.com <mailto:steve@mcclungconstruction.com> >; Kelson McClung <kelson@mcclungconstruction.com <mailto:kelson@mcclungconstruction.com> >
Subject: RE: Follow up from Presubmission meeting.
Civil plan approval for the NPR auto wrecking yard.
Tami Merriman, Associate Planner
360.458.8496
www.yelmwa.gov <http://www.yelmwa.gov/>
From: Tami Merriman
Sent: Thursday, November 5, 2020 7:42 AM
To: 'steve@mcclungconstruction.com' <steve@mcclungconstruction.com <mailto:steve@mcclungconstruction.com> >; 'kelson@mcclungconstruction.com' <kelson@mcclungconstruction.com <mailto:kelson@mcclungcon
struction.com> >
Subject: RE: Follow up from Presubmission meeting.
Steve & Kelson
I am not able to find the approved plans for the auto wrecking yard at this time. I will keep looking and get them to you as soon as they are located.
Tami Merriman, Associate Planner
360.458.8496
www.yelmwa.gov <http://www.yelmwa.gov/>
From: Tami Merriman
Sent: Thursday, November 5, 2020 6:38 AM
To: 'steve@mcclungconstruction.com' <steve@mcclungconstruction.com <mailto:steve@mcclungconstruction.com> >; 'kelson@mcclungconstruction.com' <kelson@mcclungconstruction.com <mailto:kelson@mcclungcon
struction.com> >
Subject: Follow up from Presubmission meeting.
Attached please gopher preliminary reviews that have been used in other land use approvals.
Tami Merriman, Associate Planner
360.458.8496
www.yelmwa.gov <http://www.yelmwa.gov/>
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